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Thread: When is it no longer your money?

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    Default When is it no longer your money?

    Subconciously, I think all American's favor a system that rewards work and effort. Not all physical, but whether it come from pounding shoe leather to endless risk assesments, In America most agree that work = money.

    But an Op-Ed in todays Times raises the question of whether or not we're creating an aristocracy in America. Written by Ray D. Madoff, a professor at Boston College Law School, and the author of “Immortality and the Law: The Rising Power of the American Dead” he says...

    This type of trust is new because until very recently most states had a “rule against perpetuities,” which limited the term of any family trust to about 90 years, after which time the family members would own the property outright. This rule derived from the idea that property is best controlled by the living.

    In the mid-1990s, however, many states repealed the perpetuities rule, and now any wealthy American can set property aside for his heirs forever, simply by hiring a trustee from one of these states.

    What caused state legislatures to abandon a rule that had existed since the late 1600s? Banking industry lobbyists persuaded them that it would be a lucrative move because it would bring business to their states. But it was Congress that set the stage nearly 25 years ago.

    In 1986, Congress instituted the generation-skipping transfer tax. This closed a loophole in the estate tax by ensuring that property would be subject to tax as it passed through each generation, even if it would otherwise have avoided estate taxes because it was held in trust. (It prevented “generation skipping.”) However, in enacting this tax, Congress gave each taxpayer a $1 million exemption, which was raised over the years to $3.5 million.
    I know a few of our conservative friends here would suggests that taxs are never good, but at what point do we say that it isn't your money if you didn't raise it? Its a slippery slope, but on the other end, how is this any different from the welfare state?
    “The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it comes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism - ownership of government by an individual, by a group,” - Franklin D. Roosevelt

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    That's a basic aspect of property rights. It is the last assertion of that right - if you own something you decide what will happen to it upon your death.

    That money isn't taken from anyone - it's voluntarily given. That's a pretty big difference.

    Also, as long as we're talking about a person living in an existing country with a currency and a tax system on our planet, or the United States in particular, it was probably already taxed on the way into that bank account.

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    I'd say I lost control of my money when obama was elected to head a government dominated by the democratic party. Yeah, I think that's pretty much when it happened.
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    I can see we're in a real "discussing" mood this morning.

    Anyone else?
    “The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it comes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism - ownership of government by an individual, by a group,” - Franklin D. Roosevelt

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    I read the entire citation, read your questions, and responded on point.

    So yeah, I'm in a "discussing mood."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    I'd say I lost control of my money when obama was elected to head a government dominated by the democratic party. Yeah, I think that's pretty much when it happened.
    But not before Obama? Before then your tax money wasn't yours? And it all only went for things you approved of?

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    Quote Originally Posted by JD3 View Post
    But not before Obama? Before then your tax money wasn't yours? And it all only went for things you approved of?
    Ok, you caught me. I stand guilty of being flippant. However, this regime's spending priorities; buying car companies for the benefit of the uaw, any of the spending projects under the stimulus plan, and this healthcare monstronsity, simply doesn't sit well with me. Personally, I'd like to keep just about all my monies and "starve the beast." The "beast" being this overbloated overated government of yours. I wasn't crazy about half of what bush was spending our monies on but this is ridiculous.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch View Post
    Ok, you caught me. I stand guilty of being flippant. However, this regime's spending priorities; buying car companies for the benefit of the uaw, any of the spending projects under the stimulus plan, and this healthcare monstronsity, simply doesn't sit well with me. Personally, I'd like to keep just about all my monies and "starve the beast." The "beast" being this overbloated overated government of yours. I wasn't crazy about half of what bush was spending our monies on but this is ridiculous.
    I suggest your mind reading of motives are also flippant. No president and no party would have refused to bailout the auto industry. And if he had, the failout would have been much, much worse for that president and party. So, the complaint is kind of pointless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by YankeeSpirit View Post
    on the other end, how is this any different from the welfare state?
    Not a welfare state, but an aristocracy as you mentioned. Like pure capitalism, the accumulation of wealth is a game in which there can only be one final winner. "There can only be one!"

    While I fully support parents properly raising and educating their offspring, to set them up for life does, indeed, create generations of Paris Hiltons. This is bad for our nation. This isn't about "sharing the wealth" or even giving it all to Uncle Sam to decide what to do with it, but preventing an elite class of aristocrats from sitting around their mansions suggesting that the starving masses should eat cake if there is no bread.
    All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not View Post

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    Welfare is wrong because entitlements make people rely on government when government should be teaching them to stand on their own feet. It's the whole teach a man to fish thing.

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